Path: uni-berlin.de!fu-berlin.de!news-fra1.dfn.de!npeer.de.kpn-eurorings.net!newsfeed.kabelfoon.nl!zen.net.uk!demorgan.zen.co.uk!130.88.203.18.MISMATCH!peernews.mcc.ac.uk!news.mcc.ac.uk!clerew!clw.cs.man.ac.uk!not-for-mail From: Mark Goodge Newsgroups: uk.net.news.announce,uk.net.news.management,uk.net.news.config Subject: RESULT: Amend Committee Document (Permanent Members) - Q1 FAILS, Q2 PASSES, Q3 FAILS Followup-To: uk.net.news.management Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 20:54:12 +0000 Message-ID: Sender: Charles Lindsey as Deputy Control Approved: Charles Lindsey as Deputy Control Lines: 430 Xref: uni-berlin.de uk.net.news.announce:3133 uk.net.news.management:61130 uk.net.news.config:186125 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- RESULT: Amend the committee document regarding the status of Permanent Members - Q1 FAILS, Q2 PASSES, Q3 FAILS (Please note that, due to the known ability of the "swen" virus to harvest addresses from news postings, all email addresses in this results posting, including the votetaker's "from" and "reply-to" addresses, are spamtrapped or munged.) Voting closed at 23:59:59 GMT, 7th March 2003. Proponent: Proponent: David Mahon Votetakers: Mark Goodge Distribution: uk.net.news.announce uk.net.news.management ====================================================================== The full results follow below in the following order: 1) Information on the ballot 2) Results 3) Individual Vote Details 4) Votetaker's Comments 5) Voting and Appeal Information 6) Rationale and Proposal (from the CFV) ====================================================================== INFORMATION ON THE BALLOT Voters were asked to vote on three separate proposals: Question 1: Do we abolish the Service Provider members? YES/NO (NO is the status quo) Question 2: If we do not abolish the Service Provider (Permanent) members, do we Update the network topology description? YES/NO (NO is the status quo) Question 3: If we do not abolish the Service Provider (Permanent) members, do we A) Allow the committee to select / replace them B) Elect them on a regular basis C) Something else (Re-Open Discussion) D) Status Quo ====================================================================== RESULTS There were 54 vote emails received. Question 1: YES: 13 NO: 41 NO is therefore the winner. Question 2: YES: 40 NO: 7 ABSTAIN: 7 YES beats NO (SQ) by more than 12 votes, and is therefore the winner. Question 3: This was a multi-option vote. Multi-option votes in the uk.* hierarchy are decided by a two-stage procedure. All options are first compared with votes for the status quo, and any which are not preferred to SQ by the required margin of 12 votes are eliminated. The remaining options, if any, are then evaluated by the Condorcet method. STAGE 1 Option D (SQ) equalled Option A with 25 votes each Option D (SQ) beat Option B by 39 votes to 15 Option D (SQ) beat Option C by 36 votes to 17 Therefore, Option D (SQ) wins and there is no need to proceed to a full Condorcet count. ====================================================================== INDIVIDUAL VOTE DETAILS Notes: 1. For questions 1 and 2, voters were asked to vote Yes (Y), No (N) or Abstain (A). 2. For question 3 Voters were asked to rank the options from 1 (highest) to 4 (lowest). Equal rankings are allowed, and any unranked options are considered to be ranked below all ranked options. 3. Voters used a variety of different marks (or lack of them) to indicate unranked options. Irrespective of the actual character used, all unranked options have been represented in the table by '-' (dash). 4. The votes column shows the ranking given by the voter to each option. For example: A B C D voter 1 1 2 3 4 voter 2 - 2 1 - Voter 1 ranked option A first, then B, and then C and then D. Voter 2 ranked Option C first, then B, and left the other options unranked. Q3 Name Email Q1 Q2 A B C D ==== ===== == == ======= Adam D. Barratt vote+pro+perm+2004-02?adam-barratt@org@uk N Y 2 4 3 1 Alan Fleming af?etrigan@org N Y 3 4 1 2 Alan LeHun UKvote?lehun@clara@co@uk N Y 1 4 3 2 Alastair alastair_voting?hotmail@com Y Y 2 1 3 4 Andrew Hodgson andrew?hodgsonfamily@org Y Y 2 1 3 4 Annabel Smyth annabel?amsmyth@demon@co@uk Y Y 1 2 4 3 Anthony Gold bigfoot?davros@org N N 2 4 3 1 Barry Dorrans barryd?idunno@org Y Y 4 1 2 3 Barry Salter xcomg?southie@me@uk N Y 1 4 3 2 Brett Paul Dunbar brett?dimetrodon@demon@co@uk N Y 2 4 3 1 Brian {Hamilton Kelly} bhk?dsl@co@uk N Y 2 3 4 1 Charles Lindsey chl?clerew@man@ac@uk N Y 1 4 3 2 Chris Croughton chris?keristor@org N Y 2 4 3 1 Clive Feather clive?davros@org N A 2 4 3 1 Clive R Robertson commstruct?clive@org@uk N Y 2 3 4 1 Dave Johnson requiem?freeuk@com N Y 4 3 2 1 Dave Mason xcomg2?sarnie@org@uk Y Y 4 1 2 3 Dave Mayall dave?research-group@co@uk N N 2 4 3 1 David Mahon dmahon_vote_xcomg2?amigo@co@uk Y Y 3 1 2 4 DavidUri daviduri?bigfoot@com Y Y 1 4 2 3 Edward King eaking?ulape@org@uk N A 1 - - 1 Graham Drabble graham@drabble?lineone@net N N 3 4 1 2 GT Kingston tkingston?dsl@pipex@com Y Y 2 1 3 4 I J Clifton ian@clifton?chemistry@oxford@ac@uk N Y 1 2 3 4 Iain iain?deepsea@force9@co@uk Y Y 3 1 2 3 JBM jpb8?duke@edu N A 2 4 3 1 Jeff McGhie jeff?mcghie@me@uk y y 4 1 2 4 John Reid john@reid?jazza@demon@co@uk N Y 1 4 3 2 kat kat@news?ntlworld@com N A 1 3 4 2 Keith Lawrence adsl?perrydell@com N Y 1 4 2 3 Kim Andrews somerat?hotmail@com n y 1 2 4 3 Mike Fleming mike?tauzero@co@uk N Y 3 4 2 1 Molly Mockford xcomg2?mollymockford@me@uk Y Y 1 4 3 2 Neil Ellwood neil@ellwood2?btopenworld@com N N 3 2 4 1 Owen Rees owen@rees?tesco@net N N 1 4 3 2 Paul Booth paul?grumpy@co@uk N Y 4 1 3 2 Paul Carpenter paul?pcserv@demon@co@uk N Y 1 4 3 2 Paul Cummins paul?cummins@ie@eu@org N Y 1 2 - - Paul Harper paul?harper@net Y Y 2 1 3 4 Pedt pedt?dontspame@com N Y 2 4 3 1 Pekka P. Pirinen ppp?pirinen@demon@co@uk N Y 1 4 2 3 Pete Fenelon pete?fenelon@com N Y 2 3 4 1 Pete The Gardener pete_the_gardener?hotmail@com N Y 1 4 3 2 Peter Parry peter?wpp@ltd@uk N Y 2 4 3 1 Peter Robinson pmrobinson?gmx@net N A 1 4 3 2 Peter Smyth psmyth?ukf@net N N 3 4 2 1 Philip Powell philip?blencathra@org@uk N A 2 4 3 1 Richard Clayton richard?highwayman@com N N 3 4 2 1 Richard Letts richard-vote?illuin@org N Y 2 - - 1 Roy Ellor roy?ellor@vispa@com Y Y 3 1 2 4 Steve Firth voting?malloc@co@uk N Y 2 4 1 3 Thomas Lee tfl?psp@co@uk N Y 1 4 3 2 Tim Sharrock tim?sharrock@org@uk N A 2 4 3 1 Wm tcnw61?tarrcity@demon@co@uk N Y 1 2 3 1 ====================================================================== VOTETAKER'S COMMENTS As it turned out, this was a pretty simple vote to conduct. Very few people misread the voting instructions, and there were no invalid votes. ====================================================================== VOTING AND APPEAL GUIDELINES This vote was conducted by a neutral third party member of UKVoting. UKVoting is a group of independent votetakers who count votes on behalf of the uk.* hierarchy and other 3rd parties. The rules under which votes for the uk.* hierarchy are taken are posted regularly to uk.net.news.announce or can be found at the following URL: The UKVoting web pages can be found at There is a five day discussion period after these results are posted to uk.net.news.announce. Allegations of irregularity should be sent to control at usenet dot org dot uk. ====================================================================== RATIONALE AND PROPOSAL FROM THE CFV RATIONALE In the guidelines it is stated that "The UK Network is topologically a star network, with a few central sites on an "inner ring" who feed news to their own branches, and with relatively little cross-communication between branches away from the root. Inevitably, those few central sites are in a position to control what goes out to their own branches, and are therefore classified as Major Service Providers." This is plainly quite untrue and several years out of date. There is no such "star network" and by the same definition used above, there are no "Major Service Providers". It needs replacing. In addition, because there are no "Major Service Providers", when I brought up the idea of removing / updating the description, the question of need of these "Permanent Members" was brought up once more. These members are unelected, often unheard of in uk.* usenet and are accountable only to (and represent) a small group of ISPs who have been chosen based upon historical reasoning rather than current news distribution. There is no quotable procedure for their selection, removal or replacement. There are several options and I think it is best we divide them into three questions. Question 1: Do we abolish the Service Provider members? YES/NO (NO is the status quo) Question 2: If we do not abolish the Service Provider (Permanent) members, do we Update the network topology description? YES/NO (NO is the status quo) Question 3: If we do not abolish the Service Provider (Permanent) members, do we A) Allow the committee to select / replace them B) Elect them on a regular basis C) Something else (Re-Open Discussion) D) Status Quo A & B also involves a change of name from Permanent members to Service Provider members. END RATIONALE PROPOSAL In the committee documents, principally Question 1: Replace the section "There shall be two classes of member of the Committee. Permanent Members The UK Network is topologically a star network, with a few central sites on an "inner ring" who feed news to their own branches, and with relatively little cross-communication between branches away from the root. Inevitably, those few central sites are in a position to control what goes out to their own branches, and are therefore classified as Major Service Providers. The Committee shall include, as Permanent Members, one representative of each Major Service Provider, up to a maximum of 4 permanent members. Open Members An Open Member is any person who is a reader of uk.* articles. There shall be 9 Open Members." with "There shall be 9 Committee Members." Remove all references to Permanent Members from any other committee documents and change all reference in the committee documents to "Open Member" to the generic "Member". Question 2: Replace the section "Permanent Members The UK Network is topologically a star network, with a few central sites on an "inner ring" who feed news to their own branches, and with relatively little cross-communication between branches away from the root. Inevitably, those few central sites are in a position to control what goes out to their own branches, and are therefore classified as Major Service Providers. The Committee shall include, as Permanent Members, one representative of each Major Service Provider, up to a maximum of 4 permanent members." with "Permanent Members Although the UK Network may once have been a star network, this is no longer the case. There are many news servers each of which has multiple connections to others forming a mesh-like network. There are no central sites in a position to control what comes in and out of the network as a whole. The Committee shall include, as Permanent Members, one representative of up to 4 Service Providers - a maximum of 4 permanent members." Question 3 OPTION A Replace the section: "The Committee shall include, as Permanent Members, one representative of each Major Service Provider [up to 4 Service Providers], up to a maximum of 4 permanent members." with: "The Committee should include, as Service Provider Members, the nominated representatives of up to 4 such providers, who shall each hold office for a period of 3 years. Whenever a vacancy exists (through retirement, resignation, unavailability or for any other reason) the elected members of the Committee should invite a provider that is well respected within the UK Usenet community and plays a significant role in the propagation and distribution of Usenet, to nominate such a member." Change all references in other documents to "Permanent" members into "Service Provider" members. OPTION B "The Committee shall include, as Permanent Members, one representative of each Major Service Provider [up to 4 Service Providers], up to a maximum of 4 permanent members." with: "The Committee shall include, as Service Provider Members, the elected representatives of up to 3 such providers, who shall hold office for a period of 3 years. At each annual Committee Election, all Service Provider members who have served a full 3 year term shall retire from the Committee. If at this point there are no vacant seats then the longest serving member(s) will retire (ties to be broken by lot) to create a vacant seat. Retiring members shall be eligible for re-election. Change all references in other documents to "Permanent" members into "Service Provider" members. Also change "The committee has the authority to co-opt members for the Open class. A co-opted Open member shall retire from the Committee at the next election after their co-option. The Committee SHALL NOT issue an "Intention to Co-Opt" notice for the Open class from the date that the call for nominations for the election is issued until the newly elected members have taken their places as Committee-Elect members." To "The committee has the authority to co-opt members. A co-opted member shall retire from the Committee at the next election after their co-option. The Committee SHALL NOT issue an "Intention to Co-Opt" notice from the date that the call for nominations for the election is issued until the newly elected members have taken their places as Committee-Elect members." And change "Each year during September, Control shall post (on behalf of the votetaking organisation) to uk.net.news.announce a call for nominations for the Open class of members. Nominations shall remain open for three weeks, and each candidate must receive 4 nominations; each nominator may nominate at most as many candidates in each class as there are places within that class in the election." To "Each year during September, Control shall post (on behalf of the votetaking organisation) to uk.net.news.announce a call for nominations for the Open class of members. Nominations shall remain open for three weeks, and each candidate must receive 4 nominations; each nominator may nominate at most as many candidates as there are places in the election. At the same time, nominations may also be made for the Service Provider class of membership. Prospective Service Provider members should nominate themselves directly. Their eligibility to stand in this class will be checked by UKVoting. To be eligible, a Service Provider should be responsible for a news server that peers directly with at least 10 other news servers" OPTION C ROD OPTION D Status Quo END PROPOSAL -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 5.0i Charset: noconv iQCUAwUBQF9SfGOfGXkh8vHZAQGVFgP4iDWRHhjWnYoH4MPtjc5RK1Iuvs5bbmDA 9w5984+1+kU+BnrTKhzEKSTdzZxxGCiLU5DjP9m5HT7dpLEzOPEDOgyUeJoWVCf/ GTcPWfZZBlAGsd5pP1WVdFWP0Vr7nmxj7awtQ/OjRuq8/VoCsSsoysqpyzbk9qEf OSiU2YpMEA== =AY6m -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----