RESULT: uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5 charter changes only Author: Chris M Dickson Email: b5vote@dickson.demon.co.uk Date: 1998/05/01 Forums: uk.net.news.announce, uk.net.news.config, uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5, uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5.misc Message-ID: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- RESULT OF CALL FOR VOTES Summary: PART 1: Charter changes to permit posting all non-JMS-spoiler ep titles PART 2: Charter changes to permit protected discussion of officially released video material PART 3: Charter changes to permit protected discussion of non-tv material as a reference to an existing discussion PART 4: Charter changes to ban binaries and limit advertising PART 5: Charter changes to include tagging scheme PART 6: Option two beat option three in part three therefore uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5.tvonly - not created uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5.misc - not removed ====================================================================== Voting closed at 23:59:59 GMT, Friday 17 April 1998. Proponent: alan@the-one.demon.co.uk (Alan Scobbie) Votetaker: chris@dickson.demon.co.uk (Chris M. Dickson) ====================================================================== Distribution: uk.net.news.announce, uk.net.news.config, uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5, uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5.misc ====================================================================== Voter List ========== Valid ballots were received from the following: Sarah Baker sarah.simple-signshop@demon@co@uk Mark Kennedy mark.itsilzha@demon@co@uk Arwel Parry arwel.cartref@demon@co@uk Barry Dorrans barry@dorrans.connect-2@co@uk Alan Scobbie alan.the-one@demon@co@uk Colin Wightman colin.kilroy@demon@co@uk Maura McCoy jamccoy.maurabrid@win-uk@net Andrew Wright andrew.stardock@u-net@com Ruth Aidley elp95rjm.shef@ac@uk Alex D Baxter a@baxter.ic@ac@uk Paul Harper paul_harper.ici@com David Howdon david@howdon.ccc@ox@ac@uk James Nash J@Nash.mdx@ac@uk Barry O'Neill boneil.cableinet@co@uk Russell Marshall R@Marshall.lboro@ac@uk Philip Hassall Philip@Hassall.cs@york@ac@uk Pedro Ferreira ferreira.liverpool@ac@uk Anthony Naggs amn.ubik@demon@co@uk Timothy Fisken tim.rose-cottage@demon@co@uk Tobias Erle Torex.snafu@de Tony Blakeway Tony.aqualung@demon@co@uk Will Sheward will.lcars@demon@co@uk Khianna Hearson khianna.mindless@com Adam Darcy afd.tinet@ie Jon Turner jon.acme-labs@demon@co@uk Natalie Ford N@G@Ford.surrey@ac@uk Michael Sparks zathras.babblings@ml@org Tim Gowen tim.equipoise@demon@co@uk Victoria Latham k@latham.zen@co@uk Tony Towers wibble.fishblanket@demon@co@uk Alison Hodges alison.vacuum@demon@co@uk Tim P Chadwick newsmaster.chadwickhouse@demon@co@uk Malcolm Mladenovic mbm.acm@org Ishtiaq Hussain ihuss.globalnet@co@uk Margaret Hall mhall.baradel@demon@co@uk Raj Rijhwani raj.courtfld@demon@co@uk Chris Hayes Spanner.larrrrrd@demon@co@uk Paul Bolchover pb10003.cus@cam@ac@uk Philip Sumner phil-99.geocities@com Angus Mainwaring angus.angusm@demon@co@uk Chris Wheeler chris.terim@demon@co@uk Bryan Morton bcmorton.bigfoot@com Barbara Lee barbara.barley@u-net@com John Robinson john.thebeard@demon@co@uk Argyros George Argyrou argyros@argyrou.ukonline@co@uk Joss O'Kelly josh.lichfield@prestel@co@uk Pekka P Pirinen ppp.pirinen@demon@co@uk Bruce Goatly bruce.goatly@demon@co@uk Martin Garvin marvin.indigo@ie Peter Card Peter@Card.jet@uk Alex Glennie aglennie.netcomuk@co@uk Simon Hopper hopper.ooh@dircon@co@uk Ben Webb pmbjwebb.zetnet@co@uk Shaun Gerrans Shaun.yedor@demon@co@uk Invalid ballots were received from the following: Mark Sinclair mark.rovanion@demon@co@uk Name and address were missing from ballot form Mark Rigby-Jones mark@rigby-jones.ox@compsoc@net Name and address were missing from ballot form Michael J Foy miock.mikefoy@demon@co@uk Did not vote using ballot form Stephen Watson stephen.kerofin@demon@co@uk Name and address were missing from ballot form As per the UKVoting statement, no correspondence will be entered into regarding the contents of invalid ballots and what the effect would have been of including them. ====================================================================== VOTING METHOD FOR PARTS 1, 2 AND 3 The method used to determine success or failure in AV ballots has recently been the subject of some dispute. In advance of changes to the guidelines to clarify this issue, the UK Usenet Committee have published a 'stop-gap' method to be used and this vote will be counted by it, as follows: 1. The ballot will be counted by the AV method, to produce an AV winner, the "do not change the charter" option will not be taken into account in this phase of the count. 2. The ballot will then be recounted, as a straight Yes/No between the AV winner and "Do not change the charter". The relative position of the two options will determine whether each ballot is counted for or against. If either the AV winner or "No Change" is not included in the preferences, the ballot will be counted for the option for which a preference was expressed. If neither option is shown, but a vote for any other name is present the ballot will be regarded as a vote for charter change in this phase of the count. A twelve vote majority is required at this stage to change the charter. ====================================================================== RATIONALE: The newsgroup uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5 was created to allow the discussion of "Babylon 5" episodes that had already been shown in the UK, and was intended as a "safe-haven" from the spoilers that are abundant on international forums. The group allowed the discussion of all aspects of "Babylon 5"; however this was changed with the creation of the .misc group to cover material external to the TV series (seen as an acceptable compromise at the time, as many believed that such material has the potential to spoil the television series). The current charter limits the main group to discussion of "Babylon 5", the TV series. It forbids the discussion of the series of novels and comics published by Boxtree and Titan in this country, as well as an increasing amount of what is being defined by the series creator as correct and accurate story material. This is not the creator's intention; indeed these many sources serve to enhance the series arc and will continue to explore areas of the arc that cannot be shown on TV, whilst remaining canonical, being derived from story outlines by jms. The current arrangements on the main group and .misc preclude the mainstream discussion of this material alongside the TV series. It has become apparent that .misc does not fulfill its role for those able to use it and it is felt that it is time that the situation regarding EXACTLY what constitutes the B5 Universe and where it should be discussed be resolved as clearly as possible. I therefore propose that you vote to change the charter on several occassions; by including episode titles, TV movie titles and spin-off titles; to allow protected discussion of the TV movies; to allow protected *discussion* of non-tv material; to add clarify the newsgroup's position on advertising and binary postings and to implement a new tagging system. In addition I propose that .misc be removed from the uk.* hierarchy if my other proposals are passed, as the newsgroup would become redundant and more under used. The proposal to create .tvonly was the result of the RFD process. A number of people suggested that if my proposals are implemented, they would be effectively isolated from the main group, and, as such, wish to see the creation of a new .tvonly group. Out of respect for their viewpoint, I have included this as an option on the ballot paper. There are six individual points to vote upon. ====================================================================== <*> ----------------------- <*> Part 1 : EPISODE TITLES <*> ----------------------- There are 3 options here, because of the following paragraph: BEGIN QUOTE "All titles - of episodes from the TV series "Babylon 5" which have not been aired by a major UK analogue terrestrial broadcaster - are considered spoilers and their use is BANNED in the newsgroup." END QUOTE The options for modifying this are: 1) To keep the status quo, as defined by behaviour on the newsgroup. This is currently governed by a Gentlemen's Agreement made after a straw poll. This agreement requests that people do not post episode titles to the newsgroup: however, titles of the B5 TV movies are allowed, if posted under courtesy space. Therefore, the Charter would require the addition of the following: BEGIN QUOTE "All episode titles from the TV series "Babylon 5", that have not been aired by a major UK analogue terrestrial broadcaster, are considered spoilers and their discussion is BANNED in the newsgroup. This includes their usage in ALL Subject: lines. During broadcast times the episode number should be used in the Subject: line instead. Discussion of the titles of all spin offs, including but not limited to TV movies & books, is acceptable provided courtesy space is used." END QUOTE The definition of "courtesy space" would then need to be added to the Charter. 2) To keep the status quo, as defined by the Charter The current charter allows episode titles to be discussed freely unless jms states that an episode title is a spoiler. Historically, this has proved to be problematic. 3) To allow all episode titles, including spin-offs. The Charter would require the addition of the following: BEGIN QUOTE Episode titles that are defined by JMS as a potential spoiler for future episodes (e.g., the title of 415 - "No Surrender, No Retreat") are banned from the group until such time as the episode in question is broadcast across the UK by a major analogue terrestrial broadcaster. ALL other future episode titles may be freely discussed at any time, including but not limited to the titles of the spin-off TV movies/series. END QUOTE. Ballots ======= The ballots for each voter were are follows: Option 1: ga: Gentleman's Agreement Option 2: sq: Status Quo as defined by current charter Option 3: fd: Free Discussion O1 O2 O3 Voter Name ga sq fd Preference order ============================================== Sarah: - - 1 fd Mark: 3 2 1 fd sq ga Arwel: 3 2 1 fd sq ga Barry D.: 1 3 2 ga fd sq Alan: - 2 1 fd sq Colin: 3 2 1 fd sq ga Maura: 3 2 1 fd sq ga Andrew: 1 3 2 ga fd sq Ruth: 1 3 2 ga fd sq Alex B.: 3 2 1 fd sq ga Paul H.: 3 2 1 fd sq ga David: 2 - 1 fd ga James: 2 3 1 fd ga sq Barry O': 2 3 1 fd ga sq Russell: 1 2 3 ga sq fd Philip H.: 1 3 2 ga fd sq Pedro: 2 3 1 fd ga sq Anthony: 3 2 1 fd sq ga Timothy: 2 3 1 fd ga sq Tobias: 1 3 2 ga fd sq Tony B.: 3 2 1 fd sq ga Will: 3 2 1 fd sq ga Khianna: 1 3 2 ga fd sq Adam: 2 - 1 fd ga Jon: 2 3 1 fd ga sq Natalie: - - 1 fd Michael: 2 3 1 fd ga sq Tim G.: 3 2 1 fd sq ga Victoria: 2 3 1 fd ga sq Tony T.: 2 3 1 fd ga sq Alison: - 2 1 fd sq Tim C.: - 2 1 fd sq Malcolm: - - - Ishtiaq: 2 3 1 fd ga sq Margaret: 3 2 1 fd sq ga Raj: - - X fd Chris H.: 2 - 1 fd ga Paul B.: 2 3 1 fd ga sq Philip S.: 1 3 2 ga fd sq Angus: 2 1 3 sq ga fd Chris W.: 2 3 1 fd ga sq Bryan: 3 2 1 fd sq ga Barbara: 1 2 3 ga sq fd John: 2 3 1 fd ga sq Argyros: - 2 1 fd sq Joss: 3 2 1 fd sq ga Pekka: 3 2 1 fd sq ga Bruce: - - 1 fd Martin: 1 2 3 ga sq fd Peter: 2 - 1 fd ga Alex: 1 - - ga Simon: - - 1 fd Ben: 1 2 3 ga sq fd Shaun: 2 3 1 fd gq sq Count ===== This vote was counted using the 'stop-gap' procedure specified by the UK Usenet Committee. PASS 1: Alternative vote, ignoring status quo option AV count: round 1 [status quo is ignored in pass 1] Ballots: 54, abstentions 1, quota 27 Option 1: ga: Gentleman's Agreement: 13 Option 3: fd: Free Discussion : 40 Option 3, free discussion, with 40 reaches quota (27) PASS 2: Comparison of PASS 1 winner with status quo option Yes/No for Free Discussion: YES: 47 NO: 5 ABS: 2 Result: Option 3, free discussion, wins AV and passes +12 (42) v status quo ====================================================================== <*> ------------------------- <*> Part 2: SEQUEL AND MOVIES <*> ------------------------- At some point in 1998, the two Babylon 5 TV movies will be released on video and (probably) broadcast by Channel Four. It is most likely that the movies will be released on commercial video prior to C4 broadcast. Inevitably (as has been demonstrated previously) someone will post about these movies once they are released in the UK, thus potentially spoiling them for the rest of the group who haven't seen them unless pre-set guidelines are in place for this eventuality. There are therefore 3 proposals to choose from: 1) To prohibit such material until broadcast by a terrestrial UK broadcaster. This involves the addition of the following to the charter: BEGIN QUOTE "Discussion of B5 televisual material that has not been aired by an analogue terrestrial UK broadcaster is BANNED. In the event that the material airs in one part of the UK and not another, protection in the form of tagging & courtesy space - see below - must be used. This protection must remain until such time as it has been aired throughout the UK." END QUOTE Note this includes the S4C problem and also covers the eventuality that C5 airs the telemovies first. 2) To keep the status quo The current charter would leave this to prohibit discussion of the contents of all videos that contain any B5 televisual material that has not aired on Channel 4. 3) Free, but protected, discussion of Video material. It is proposed to keep discussion of all relevant televisual B5 material on the main group and allow discussion of the videos of B5 material before terrestrial broadcast under (VIDEO) space. This would operate under the same principle as (SC4!) space (see Part 5). This tag would cover the sequel, telemovies and any S5 episodes released on video prior to their broadcast on terrestrial, as well as any possible further spin offs of the B5 saga that may be produced. Therefore addition of this following text would be required: BEGIN QUOTE "Discussion of all B5 televisual material that has been broadcast by an analogue terrestrial UK broadcaster is encouraged. In the event that the material airs in one part of the UK and not another protection in the form of tagging & courtesy space - see below - must be used. Discussion of B5 televisual material (eg episodes/films) that has not been transmitted by an analogue terrestrial broadcaster is prohibited, unless it has been released in the UK on commercial video. If the material has been released in this form, it may ONLY be discussed with the use of protection, in the form of tagging & courtesy space, as discussed below. NOTE: In effect this specifically prohibits using material from illegal pirate videos as a source of information." END QUOTE Ballots ======= The ballots for each voter were are follows: Option 1: bb: Ban discussion until Broadcast Option 2: sq: Status Quo Option 3: pd: Protected Discussion of released material O1 O2 O3 Voter Name bb sq pd Preference order ============================================== Sarah: - - 1 pd Mark: 3 2 1 pd sq bb Arwel: 3 2 1 pd sq bb Barry D.: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Alan: - 2 1 pd sq Colin: 3 2 1 pd sq bb Maura: 3 2 1 pd sq bb Andrew: 1 3 2 bb pd sq Ruth: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Alex B.: 1 2 3 bb sq pd Paul H.: 2 3 1 pd bb sq David: 1 2 - bb sq James: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Barry O': 2 3 1 pd bb sq Russell: 2 1 3 sq bb pd Philip H.: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Pedro: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Anthony: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Timothy: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Tobias: 3 2 1 pd sq bb Tony B.: 1 2 3 bb sq pd Will: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Khianna: 1 3 2 bb pd sq Adam: 3 2 1 pd sq bb Jon: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Natalie: - - 1 pd Michael: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Tim G.: 3 2 1 pd sq bb Victoria: 3 2 1 pd sq bb Tony T.: 1 2 3 bb sq pd Alison: 1 2 - bb sq Tim C.: - 2 1 pd sq Malcolm: - - - Ishtiaq: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Margaret: 1 2 3 bb sq pd Raj: - X - sq Chris H.: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Paul B.: 1 3 2 bb pd sq Philip S.: 1 3 2 bb pd sq Angus: 2 1 3 sq bb pd Chris W.: 1 2 3 bb sq pd Bryan: 3 2 1 pd sq bb Barbara: 2 3 1 pd bb sq John: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Argyros: 2 - 1 pd bb Joss: - - 1 pd Pekka: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Bruce: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Martin: 1 2 3 bb sq pd Peter: 2 - 1 pd bb Alex: - - - Simon: 1 - 2 bb pd Ben: 1 3 2 bb pd sq Shaun: 2 3 1 pd bb sq Count ===== This vote was counted using the 'stop-gap' procedure specified by the UK Usenet Committee. PASS 1: Alternative vote, ignoring status quo option AV count: round 1 [status quo is ignored in pass 1] Ballots: 54, abstentions 3, quota 26 Option 1: bb: Ban discussion until Broadcast : 16 Option 3: pd: Protected Discussion of released material: 35 Option 3, Protected Discussion of released material, with 35 reaches quota (26) PASS 2: Comparison of PASS 1 winner with status quo option Yes/No for Free Discussion: YES: 41 NO: 11 ABS: 2 Result: Option 3, Protected Discussion of released material, wins AV and passes +12 (30) v status quo ====================================================================== <*> ----------------------- <*> Part 3: NON-TV MATERIAL <*> ----------------------- [This banner title includes such items as the books, comics, role playing games, CD-ROMS, magazines, trading cards and indeed anything that uses B5 as a basis for it's construction] Much of the story of B5 is spread across the non-televisual material widely available to purchase, and is exemplified by the novel "To Dream in the City of Sorrows" which contains the following note: "An official, authorised chapter in the Babylon 5 story line...and should be considered as authentic as any episode in the regular series." J. Michael Straczynski Preface to "To Dream in the City of Sorrows" Since some of the current novels and many of those to come are also to be considered in the same light by the creator of Babylon 5 - J. Michael Straczynski. In theory .misc was designed to cover this, but in practice Charter restrictions mean this is impractical (.misc outright bans tv only discussion, and the main group prohibits discussion of any non-tv material) Again, there are 3 options: 1) Keep the status quo This would involve no changes to the charter which forbids discussion of ALL non-tv material. 2) Allow limited, protected, discussion of non-tv material as a reference to an existing discussion. This would involve modifying the charter in the following manner: BEGIN QUOTE "Non-Televisual (specifically printed) material that is commercially available throughout the UK may only be used as a REFERENCE. It is not to be used as the starting point of a discussion; any such discussion belongs on .misc." N.B. (i) A "commercially available" item is defined as an item that is published in the UK or one that is widely available in the UK through a number of companies or locales. N.B.(ii) Any information which would act as a spoiler to unbroadcast episodes of the TV series is obviously banned. N.B.(iii) Common sense must be used to decide which parts of the material are considered "REFERENCE" and therefore allowed. As a guide, large chunks of plotline are definitely not considered reference whereas minor details of characters (such as names) definitely are. A REFERENCE is only acceptable when it is RELEVANT to an on-going discussion of the TV series, and is suitably protected, by including tagging & courtesy space for all such material; see below. ANY Item which contains references to ANY B5 TV programme (for instance, the novelisation of any B5 TV Movie) which has not been transmitted by a terrestrial broadcaster is prohibited, unless it has been released in the UK on commercial video If the material has been released in this form, it may ONLY be discussed with the use of protection, in the form of tagging & courtesy space." END QUOTE 3) Allow free, but protected, discussion of all non-tv story material. This would involve adding the following to the charter, and removing the paragraph banning such material. BEGIN QUOTE "Discussion of canon non-tv story material as described above is allowed IF protection in the form of tagging & courtesy space is used as described below. Tagging & protection for such material is to be used permanently due to the fact that some do not wish (or cannot etc) to purchase such material. ANY Item which contains references to ANY B5 TV programme (for instance, the novelisation of any B5 TV Movie) which has not been transmitted by a terrestrial broadcaster is prohibited, unless it has been released in the UK on commercial video. If the material has been released in this form, it may ONLY be discussed with the use of protection, in the form of tagging & courtesy space." END QUOTE Ballots ======= The ballots for each voter were are follows: Option 1: sq: Status Quo Option 2: pr: Protected Reference to non-tv material Option 3: pd: Protected Discussion of non-tv material O1 O2 O3 Voter Name sq pr pd Preference order ============================================== Sarah: - - 1 pd Mark: 3 2 1 pd pr sq Arwel: 3 2 1 pd pr sq Barry D.: 2 1 3 pr sq pd Alan: - 2 1 pd pr Colin: 3 2 1 pd pr sq Maura: 2 1 3 pr sq pd Andrew: 2 3 1 pd sq pr Ruth: 1 3 2 sq pd pr Alex B.: 1 2 3 sq pr pd Paul H.: 3 2 1 pd pr sq David: 1 2 - sq pr James: 1 2 3 sq pr pd Barry O': 1 2 3 sq pr pd Russell: 1 2 3 sq pr pd Philip H.: 3 1 2 pr pd sq Pedro: 3 2 1 pd pr sq Anthony: 2 3 1 pd sq pr Timothy: 3 1 2 pr pd sq Tobias: 1 2 3 sq pr pd Tony B.: 3 1 2 pr pd sq Will: 3 2 1 pd pr sq Khianna: 1 2 3 sq pr pd Adam: 3 1 2 pr pd sq Jon: 3 2 1 pd pr sq Natalie: - 1 2 pr pd Michael: 3 2 1 pd pr sq Tim G.: 1 - - sq Victoria: 3 1 2 pr pd sq Tony T.: - 1 - pr Alison: 2 1 - pr sq Tim C.: - 2 1 pd pr Malcolm: - - - Ishtiaq: 3 2 1 pd pr sq Margaret: 3 2 1 pd pr sq Raj: X - - sq Chris H.: 2 1 - pr sq Paul B.: 1 3 2 sq pd pr Philip S.: 1 2 3 sq pr pd Angus: 1 2 3 sq pr pd Chris W.: 1 2 3 sq pr pd Bryan: 3 2 1 pd pr sq Barbara: 3 2 1 pd pr sq John: 1 2 3 sq pr pd Argyros: 1 - - sq Joss: - 1 - pr Pekka: 3 1 2 pr pd sq Bruce: 2 1 3 pr sq pd Martin: 1 2 3 sq pr pd Peter: - 2 1 pd pr Alex: - - - Simon: 3 2 1 pd pr sq Ben: 3 1 2 pr pd sq Shaun: 3 2 1 pd pr sq Count ===== This vote was counted using the 'stop-gap' procedure specified by the UK Usenet Committee. PASS 1: Alternative vote, ignoring status quo option AV count: round 1 [status quo is ignored in pass 1] Ballots: 54, abstentions 5, quota 25 Option 2: pr: Protected Reference to non-tv material : 27 Option 3: pd: Protected Discussion of non-tv material: 22 Option 2, Protected Reference to non-tv material, with 27 reaches quota (25) PASS 2: Comparison of PASS 1 winner with status quo option Yes/No for Protected Reference to non-tv material: YES: 32 NO: 19 ABS: 3 Result: Option 2, Protected Reference to non-tv material, wins AV and passes +12 (13) v status quo Note that due to option 2 succeeding in part 3, the votes taken as part 6 about whether to create .tvonly and remove .misc immediately get ignored; .misc is not removed and .tvonly is not created. This is as a direct result of the criterion specified on the ballot paper. ====================================================================== <*> ------------------------------------- <*> Part 4: ADVERTISING & BINARY POSTINGS <*> ------------------------------------- The current charter lacks a section on such posts. To bring umtsb5's charter in line with it's companion groups, I propose to add the following paragraphs to the charter, taken directly from the charters of umtsb5.misc and umtsb5.social. BEGIN QUOTE "Binary postings are FORBIDDEN. Advertising is only acceptable when it is short, when it is relevant to the primary topic of the newsgroup (ie Babylon 5), & when what is advertised is reasonably available to the UK readership of the group." END QUOTE Ballots ======= No individual list of each voter's preference is appropriate here. All fifty-four voters, as named in the "Valid Ballots received from" list, voted "yes". Count ===== Should the charter be changed as described to prohibit binaries and restrict advertising? Yes = 54 Abstain = 0 No = 0 Result: as Yes >= No + 12 (54 is greater than 0 + 12, which is 12) then the charter changes as described. ====================================================================== <*> -------------------------------- <*> Part 5: TAGGING & COURTESY SPACE <*> -------------------------------- Tagging & courtesy space for SC4 users have become a standard feature of this newsgroup. It has become clear that extending this idea has strong potential to "confuse" both new and old posters alike, therefore it is hoped that the following forms a sensible solution to the problem. I propose to add the following text to the charter: BEGIN QUOTE "In this section, courtesy space is defined as: 25 lines of text where each line contains a single non-blank character and a carriage return followed by a single ^L (page break character) where possible. NOTE: courtesy space may be used at any time, and is wise to use when you go near the limits of the Charter to avoid upsetting anyone, and especially if you think that any member of the news group will find your post contentious. Erring on the side of CAUTION is recommended under ALL circumstances. USE OF TAGGING: A tag would be used by placing it as the *first* part of a subject line: for instance: Subject: (S4C!) 404 Squids! The brackets are important, as this clearly defines where the tag ends and the Subject: line begins. The ratified set of tags is as follows: (S4C!) This tag would be used if terrestrial transmitted material has not aired in Wales. This is a common situation if Channel Four is airing Babylon 5. (C5!) This tag would be used if any "Babylon 5" televisual material is broadcast on Channel Five. This is due to the limited reception of this terrestrial broadcaster in the UK. (VID) This tag is proposed for a post containing any reference to material that is only available in the UK on commercial video - as laid down by part 2. (NONTV) This tag is proposed for a post contains a reference/ discussion of non-tv story material widely available in the UK. (NOTE this only allows CANON material) This tag must be used as outlined in part 3. (BOLOX) This tag is proposed for items which can be defined as a "scenery" in the B5 Universe (for instance Micro Machines, Action Figures, models etc) and any non-story related merchandise that is not covered by any of the 3 tags above. Discussion on this type of material would remain on .misc if it were not removed, and the tag would then simply apply to any item not covered by the other 3 tags, but which would require Courtesy space." END QUOTE Having the minimum number of tags should keep things reasonably simple. It would be clear, for instance that posts entitled: Subject: (NONTV) Book 9 Comments or Subject: (NONTV) Observations on Latest B5 Comic Strip were about the Book and Comic respectively. Ballots ======= The ballots for each voter were are follows: Y: Yes, change charter as described A: Abstain N: No, do not change charter Voter Name Vote ======================== Sarah: Y Mark: Y Arwel: Y Barry D.: Y Alan: Y Colin: Y Maura: Y Andrew: Y Ruth: Y Alex B.: Y Paul H.: Y David: A James: Y Barry O': Y Russell: N Philip H.: Y Pedro: Y Anthony: N Timothy: Y Tobias: Y Tony B.: Y Will: Y Khianna: N Adam: Y Jon: Y Natalie: Y Michael: Y Tim G.: Y Victoria: Y Tony T.: Y Alison: N Tim C.: N Malcolm: N Ishtiaq: Y Margaret: Y Raj: N Chris H.: N Paul B.: Y Philip S.: Y Angus: N Chris W.: Y Bryan: A Barbara: Y John: Y Argyros: A Joss: A Pekka: N Bruce: Y Martin: N Peter: Y Alex: A Simon: A Ben: N Shaun: Y Count ===== Should the text with the proposed list of tags as described be added to the charter? Yes = 36 Abstain = 6 No = 12 Result: as Yes >= No + 12 (36 is greater than 12 + 12, which is 24) then the charter changes as described. ====================================================================== <*> ---------------------------------------------- <*> PART 6: Future of uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5.misc <*> ---------------------------------------------- IMPORTANT NOTE: The ballot paper specified that option three must succeed in both part two and part three for part six votes to take effect. Option two succeeded in part three, so these votes do not take effect; no newsgroups are created or removed. If some or all of the above changes are passed then some people have expressed a desire to see .misc removed as there will be no need for it. However others have stated that it could be useful for discussion of non-story related merchandise such as the models. We are not sure and have no strong opinions for either option so will include the question: "Should the newsgroup uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5.misc be removed if the above changes are passed, or be kept to discuss non-story related merchandise?" It has also been suggested that a TV ONLY group should be created allowing those who have a wish to ONLY discuss B5 as a TV Programme. Therefore the following question will be included: "Should a new newsgroup uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5.tvonly be created to allow exclusive discussion of the TV aspects of B5?" If created, the new newsgroup would have the charter as below. ====================================================================== Charter: Newsgroup Line: uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5.tvonly Discussion of the B5 TV show only Unmoderated newsgroup. Purpose of the news group The purpose of uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5.tvonly is to facilitate discussion about the science fiction television programme Babylon 5 from a UK perspective. It was created as there was a significant need for a newsgroup to discuss only the television series, with no reference or discussion of its non-tv aspects. Spoiler Policy ABSOLUTELY NO discussion is permitted in the newsgroup of any episodes that have not been broadcast by Channel 4. If you have seen an episode in advance of the Channel 4 broadcast & wish to talk about it, then the places to do such a thing are the international forums like rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5, or the CompuServe forums. Similarly, ABSOLUTELY NO story information gleaned from sources such as magazine articles or other newsgroups in advance of the UK TV broadcast is permitted. ABSOLUTELY NO discussion is permitted in the newsgroup of sources of plot information which have not been derived by viewing the television programme as broadcast in the UK by C4 or S4C which may constitute a spoiler to those who are only following the television programme. Such sources of information include (but are not limited to) the textual & graphical novels, the role playing games, attendance at conventions etc. One appropriate place for such discussion is the uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5 newsgroup. For your guidance, here are a couple of comments on what defines a spoiler: "A spoiler is any piece of information which has the potential to adversely affect an individual's enjoyment of a previously unseen episode. You will note the phrase 'has the potential to adversely affect' and not 'adversely affects'. The reason is simple: different people are of different sensitivities, and have different ideas on what marres their enjoyment. It is not for any one of us to tell the other how to enjoy it, but courtesy merits consideration of the most flexible definition that accomodates the most tastes. In addition, an illegal spoiler is any piece of information (such as the title of episode 322 - Z'Ha'Dum) which the story's creator jms has expressly stated that advanced knowledge of which is going to be a spoiler, until such time as jms states that it is no longer a spoiler for UK viewers." All episodes broadcast by Channel 4 in England, Scotland, & Northern Ireland shall remain 'protected' for the sake of the Welsh who do not get to see the programme on S4C for some time after the rest of the UK - typically between 1 & 2 weeks. The nature of this protection shall be as follows: The word 'S4C!:' shall precede the episode title (or a meaningful abbreviation) at the start of the subject line. The body text of the post shall be preceded by approximately 25 lines of carriage return characters, followed by a ^L character. This 'spoiler space' shall not significantly exceed 30 lines, & neither shall it be filled with 'ascii-art'. You may quote other peoples' spoiler space. Ballots ======= IMPORTANT NOTE: The ballot paper specified that option three must succeed in both part two and part three for part six votes to take effect. Option two succeeded in part three, so these votes do not take effect; no newsgroups are created or removed. The ballots for each voter were are follows: Ballot R: Y: Yes, remove the .misc newsgroup A: Abstain N: No, do not remove the .misc newsgroup Ballot C: Y: Yes, create the .tvonly newsgroup A: Abstain N: No, do not create the .tvonly newsgroup Voter Name R C ========================== Sarah: Y N Mark: Y N Arwel: Y Y Barry D.: N N Alan: A N Colin: N Y Maura: Y Y Andrew: N A Ruth: Y Y Alex B.: A A Paul H.: N Y David: Y Y James: Y Y Barry O': A A Russell: N Y Philip H.: A A Pedro: N Y Anthony: N A Timothy: A A Tobias: N N Tony B.: N Y Will: Y A Khianna: N N Adam: Y Y Jon: Y N Natalie: A A Michael: Y Y Tim G.: N - Victoria: A A Tony T.: A A Alison: Y Y Tim C.: N Y Malcolm: A A Ishtiaq: Y N Margaret: Y A Raj: - - Chris H.: N N Paul B.: Y N Philip S.: N Y Angus: Y Y Chris W.: Y Y Bryan: A A Barbara: A A John: Y Y Argyros: A Y Joss: N A Pekka: Y N Bruce: A A Martin: A Y Peter: N Y Alex: A A Simon: Y Y Ben: Y Y Shaun: Y Y Count ===== IMPORTANT NOTE: The ballot paper specified that option three must succeed in both part two and part three for part six votes to take effect. Option two succeeded in part three, so these votes do not take effect; no newsgroups are created or removed. Should the uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5.misc newsgroup be removed? Yes = 22 Abstain = 15 No = 16 Result: as No + 12 >= Yes (16 + 12, which is 28, is greater than 22) then the newsgroup would not have been removed even if option three had succeeded in part three. Should the uk.media.tv.sf.babylon5.tvonly newsgroup be created? Yes = 24 Abstain = 17 No = 11 Result: as Yes >= No + 12 (24 is greater than 11 + 12, which is 23) then the newsgroup would have been created if option three had succeeded in part three. ====================================================================== This vote was conducted by a neutral third party member of UKVoting. UKVoting is a group of independent votetakers who count votes on CFVs in the uk hierarchy. The rules under which this vote is taken are posted regularly to uk.net.news.announce or can be found at the following URL: ftp://src.doc.ic.ac.uk/usenet/news-info/news.answers/uk/voting There is a five day discussion period after these results are posted to uk.net.news.announce. Allegations of irregularity should be sent to control@usenet.org.uk as soon as possible. - -- Chris M Dickson -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6 iQCVAgUBNUoU22OfGXkh8vHZAQEq4QP+IYadPdcUkoyFb6vo7HMoqG6OAuLJvwVc UsPENIhSElADn9BBsuj4eJahIUPRt/hZIc3tO9DAAdCnCuubuHI4A5uQwev1dqZJ YogPJze69h/yMq+7YUkDypNmqoA7MyHWQsE81kGAdNm/NunC/qCk9MgNBN1Up18U 9MKaklnEAAM= =Y5FC -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----